October sales figures...

[GhaleonOne]

...were quite disappointing.

http://www.lunar-net.com/news.php?id=63

[Mychael216]

I can no longer foresee a Lunar 3 or any continuation of the series whatsoever...

Until, that is, I buy the series and pump out more Lunar-y awesomeness!

[Angelalex242]

As bad as I anticipated...

Then again, people do read reviews, and upon reading the battle system reviews...how can we blame people for not buying it?

[Rune Lai]

I wouldn't lay it solely on the reviews. Given that even the people who've played the game agree that Dragon Song is not a particularly remarkable piece of work, there's not much incentive for people to rush out and buy it. Word of mouth counts for something too.

[GhaleonOne]

I still think word of mouth sold Lunar SSSC into success.

[phyco126]

Just think though, we have to take into consideration the people who want the game, but can't get the game. Like me.

[segaboy7]

You know these sales don't really scare me, Because I am sure
Game arts/JAM see they have made a pretty substandered or by some ppl horrible game, if so this my be fuel for them to correct the matter and prove to there fans they can still make a good lunar. Even if GA becomes part of Gung-ho I can still see a new Lunar in due time.

[Kizyr]

Well, if there's a Lunar game that comes by where the developers and publishers actually put some effort into...

Despite my thoughts about Vic (WD), he did have a valid point when he mentioned the lack of regard UbiSoft gives to the Lunar series. Though, there was a lack of regard from MMV's end as well. KF

[Siazair]

Anyone vote to have WD take back Lunar?

[phyco126]

Well, I can easily say that I was severly disappointed about WD dropping Lunar. Myself, I didn't become a fan of WD because of other people being fans, I became a fan of WD after playing SSSC. I had actually never even heard of WD until then. As a matter of fact, because of SSSC, I wanted to buy several other games from them (including Arc The Lad Collection.) Alas, foolishness took hold and I blew my money down the drain.

Regardless, I still like WD, but I doubt they will be in business much longer.

Speaking of which, how well did EBC sell compared to SSSC? I know SSSC was their best selling game, which is why it shocked me when WD dropped (or whatever happened) the Lunar license.

[GhaleonOne]

While I know it's true WD needs to get a game or two out, I think some of the rumors about their demise are a bit over-exaggerated at times. What I do find interesting is if GameArts decides to go through with another Lunar. Since it's obvious the game probably didn't even meet expectations for UbiSoft, I'm wondering if they'll bother publishing another game in the series if it comes up. And since GungHo, who, as far as I know, is a Japan-only publisher, I would think it would be possible WD might be offered the right to publish a Lunar game in the future. They're the ones that made the series popular here, like 'em or hate 'em. I'm sure GameArts might be willing to try that option out again, depending on things with UbiSoft.

Obviously this is a long-shot theory, but I still think it's possible if GameArts gives the series another go. They have to realize the failure of this game wasn't as much due to the series itself as it was the major problems with the individual game.

Edit - Just to respond directly phyco, SSSC did 223,000 copies while EBC did 170,000 copies. Roughly. While it might show SSSC outsold EBC, it shows people were quite interested in the sequel. Sequels will likely never outsell the first game, when you consider how the games are connected by story. Plus, EB and EBC both came out later in their system's lifespan. TSS and SSSC hit the market at close to the peak timing. In fact, the stats for those who owned TSS and owned a Sega CD are staggering if I recall. I can't remember the exact amounts, but the ratio was extremely high in favor of TSS. EB, on the other hand, actually lost WD money as it came out way after the Sega CD had pretty much died here. But for EBC to do that well after SSSC, it shows that the series remained strong through it. Which is why I still think, if given a good platform (ie. let's get it back on a console) and actually making the game solid and worthy of the Lunar name, it would at least be profitable.

[phyco126]

Well, I'm just basing the fact that WD won't last long, mostly based on them not doing any games (if they are, I must have missed it.)

As for copies sold, that is an impressive, but unfortunatly small number, to be sold. While I'm sure both SSSC and EBC made WD some serious money, one can only imagine what money they could have made if the games sold anywhere near the amount of *gag*FFVII*gag*

As for making another Lunar game, sure if WD does it this time, and they actually make the game good, then yeah, it'll sell better than the last to Lunar's that have hit the shelves. However, I'm sure that Lunar would sell good on a portable if they actually made the game worthwhile as well. I mean, what if L: DS didn't have the problems it did? Same story, but no bugs and a better battle system. Does anyone think that might have affected sales? I don't know if something like that would, but I would imagine you would notice a difference.

[GhaleonOne]

Uh, noone expected SSSC or EBC to come close to FFVII's numbers. FFVII was marketed by Sony. Working Designs didn't exactly have the money Sony had to market it like. And even if they had, the 2D style would have immediately thrown many off. This was at a time when 3D was pretty new and people were going nuts for it. For Lunar's development costs and the kind of title it was (*gasp* 2D traditional style) Sony was quite shocked at such success. Lunar SSSC and EBC were extreme successes for a company the size of Working Designs.

it'll sell better than the last to Lunar's that have hit the shelves.

Actually, Legend did quite well. Over 100k from my understanding.

[Rune Lai]

Yep. Legend did over 100k. Might have been around 120k, though I can't check at the moment.

It's really late, but I just wanted to correct something.

Sequels will likely never outsell the first game, when you consider how the games are connected by story.

I've have to disagree with this. System lifespans and timing can explain why one game will do worse than another in the same series, but sequels can do quite well even if they are tied to an earlier game. Shadow Hearts 2 takes place a year after the first game and even has the same protagonist! And yet it sold better than its predecessor. Suikoden III is also the best selling installment of the series to date, despite being the third one in a pre-existing universe. There are probably other examples, but I can't think of them offhand.

I think it's more likely that EBC's problem was that by the time it came out in the US it looked too dated in comparision to the rest of the games out there. It might have been a good game, but it didn't take take advantage of the technology that the other games selling at that time were using.

[phyco126]

Well, of course no one would expect the games to sell anywhere close to FFVII, but I was referencing to the fact that if they did sell as well as Final Fantasy, it may have very well come made WD a very successful company. At least in terms of how big the company was and the money it cost to develope the games. Besides, didn't WD purposefully pull the games from the shelfs (actually, that's wrong, I should say stopped production) to keep the games a collectors item? I recall hearing somewhere that they didn't want it to end up on the Greatest Hits shelf

As for L:L, I'm honestly quite surprised. Last I check, everyone was saying how baddly the game sold ;-;

[Jyd3n]

Man, this is the most depressing news I've heard on a Monday in awhile. The hopes of a Lunar 3 were riding on this game and well, to put it plainly, it's a flop.

The game isn't that bad but I don't think it got enough publicity to get good sales. In fact, I'll bet that in a couple of months people are going to find the game and go "Hey, when did this game come out? I didn't know they still made Lunar games."

[drumlord]

I'm with Rune on sequels. I was too lazy to respond before. But video games don't follow the same rules as movies (who very occasionally break that sequel rule). Halo 2 I believe sold more than Halo. GTA 3 and beyond simply slaughtered GTA 1 and 2. Super Mario Bros 3 outdid 1 and 2 (I think). Without sales numbers right in front of me, it's hard to say. But there's plenty more than those examples.

Throughout the history of video games, some sequels have outsold their predecessors. Besides the reasons Rune listed like system life, sequels can also do better by living off the hype of the original, the publisher putting more money into marketing this time around, publisher simply doing a larger initial shipment. Publishers put like a million spreadsheets together to determine how best to market and distribute games, but you still get mistakes like Katamari Damacy, where surprise! Everybody wants one and you can't fill demand. I wouldn't be surprised if We Love Katamari has outsold it after all the hype for the original.

[GhaleonOne]

Halo 2 I believe sold more than Halo. GTA 3 and beyond simply slaughtered GTA 1 and 2. Super Mario Bros 3 outdid 1 and 2 (I think). Without sales numbers right in front of me, it's hard to say. But there's plenty more than those examples.

Well, I only meant in regards to story-driven RPGs that were connected. I know many games like that aren't going to follow that rule. However, Rune threw out enough examples to throw even that claim off.

[Rune Lai]

Besides, didn't WD purposefully pull the games from the shelfs (actually, that's wrong, I should say stopped production) to keep the games a collectors item? I recall hearing somewhere that they didn't want it to end up on the Greatest Hits shelf

I can't pretend to know what WD's business plan was, but I really can't see why it would be a good idea to avoid becoming a Greatest Hits title. Games typically get a sales bump once they hit the Greatest Hits series, and who doesn't want a sales bump? Companies, once they know they have a bonafide hit on their hands, will even plan for when they decide to join the Greatest Hits series so as to maximum that extra crop of sales.

I seem to remember an ad campaign saying that SSS would be pulled off the shelves, but I don't think EBC ever was. I bought that one a hideously long time after it came out and if it had really been yanked I wouldn't have been able to do that. I think (just a thought) that SSS may have been pulled off the shelves for much the same reason Disney is known for yanking their classic animated titles out of stores--to create demand. The SSS-yanking happened before their fan-version rerelease, if I remember right, so it's possible they pulled it in preparation for the fanart release in hopes or stirring demand and then selling more copies.

I've never heard of that being done before, so it's just a random shot in the dark at what the rationale might have been.

As for L:L, I'm honestly quite surprised. Last I check, everyone was saying how baddly the game sold ;-;

Nah, L:L sold a perfectly respectable number. It's nothing groundbreaking, but solid enough that it may have influenced Ubi to invest in Dragon Song.

[GhaleonOne]

The SSS-yanking happened before their fan-version rerelease, if I remember right, so it's possible they pulled it in preparation for the fanart release in hopes or stirring demand and then selling more copies.

I'd say, if that were the case, it would be due to the PC version coming. The fanart release was made because they were canning the PC version. SSS was pulled off shelves way before that though, and I don't think WD even thought of the fanart edition until they were contemplating the canning of the PC Lunar.