SSSC connections (blatant and subtle) to EBC and DS

[DaWrestla]

So I already kind of started a thread like this when I noticed the first blatant connection, but now that I noticed more I'm going to make this the "official" thread for such connections. So far, this is what I found:

1) In the Vane library, there is a scroll on the wall by the head librarian that talks about the Blue Spire on the Blue Star. This would suggest, as I stated previously, that the Blue Spire on Lunar at the time of SSSC is not visible on the map. Based on its location in EBC, the Blue Spire is somewhere in the Frontier in SSSC

2) In Damon's Spire one of the books mentions that Althena leaves the Blue Star in the hands of a young girl (i.e. Lucia) when she (Althena) leaves for the Silver Star.

3) In Damon's Spire one of the books mentions that it was (paraphrasing) "a huge fortress" that transported the people of the Blue Star to the Silver Star. Taken literally, this would imply a spaceship of somesort. Taken a little more liberally, it's safe to say this "huge fortress" is the Blue Spire.

4) In Damon's Spire one of the books mentions something about evil creeping into the hearts of men on the Blue Star. Take a look at the EBC cutscene where people turn into Demons because they were filled with evil. (This one is going off more memory than the others, so it might not be entirely accurate).

5) In Damon's Spire one of the books talks about a dragonmaster into the desert on the back of the white dragon. I can't remember, but I seem to remember the book saying it was the first dragonmaster. Does this mean that the book is talking about (DS Spoiler)[spoiler] Ignatius? Since Lunar DS is really Lunar Genesis, is Ignatius the first Dragonmaster? The Dragonmaster that assisted Althena in transforming the Silver Star? There is a desert in DS, afterall. Or, would Ignatius be the second dragonmaster of the history of the Silver Star?[/spoiler]

That seems to be all for now. I'm really appreciating these games even more with a second playthrough! Discuss.

[Roas Atrades]

Well, the fact that SSSC has predictions is not really that surprising. After all, it is the remake of TSS, and of course EB had already been released before SSSC was made. So, with the knowledge that EBC is on the horizen, Game Arts was safely making predictions it would confirm in the next game.

Now, if TSS had predictions about EB, then I would be really impressed. Of course, and older players feel free to back me up because I don't feel like plugging in my SegaCD , TSS does nothing for predictions about EB.

As for the DS possible prediction, I have no comment since I have not played the game.

[segaboy7]

I would like to think thats what it meant, but to me its painfully obvious that Lunar DS has no connection to either lunar game, nor does it fit in the timeline, thus becoming a somewhat painfull sidestory. I feel this way because there no mention of Jian in any lunar game, and nor can any of those weird names like dragonmaster stonefist, or whatever it was. These names don't reference Jian because if you read the jam's president's blog, the first concepts for jian was a young boy warrior, with a sword. Jian was later turned into a character that fights with his feet, as the creator was inspirered by dancers in japan. So to be honest I feel DS is just a truly unfitting entry to the series

[DaWrestla]

Well, the fact that SSSC has predictions is not really that surprising. After all, it is the remake of TSS, and of course EB had already been released before SSSC was made. So, with the knowledge that EBC is on the horizen, Game Arts was safely making predictions it would confirm in the next game.

Crap! That's right Oh well, it was cool *at the time*. Way to ruin it for me

nor does [DS] fit in the timeline

Huh, how so? Granted, I agree that is overall adds nothing to the Lunar series (a remake would take care of that), but it certainly fits into the timeline.

[GhaleonOne]

It doesn't fit in the sense that many of the books in Vane speak of a Magic Empire 1000 years prior to Lunar 1. Yet, Lunar DS is 1000 years before Lunar 1 and there is no Magic Empire. Same with Vane. Vane was said to have been raised to the skies 1000 years before Lunar 1, due to a flooding of the world by Althena's tears. It's issues like these that throw shadows on Lunar DS. I'm sure explinations can be made for it, but these issues should have been addressed.

[Werefrog]

Spoilers for DS

[spoiler]I'm pretty sure that Ignatius is not the first Dragonmaster. The first Dragonmaster was also the first person (either beastman, human, or member of the Vile Tribe) to walk the surface of Lunar.

I at least hope Ignatius was not the first Dragonmaster because I think that would make the Lunar Universe way too small (sort of like Lucas did with Star Wars).[/spoiler]

[Roas Atrades]

that would make the Lunar Universe way too small (sort of like Lucas did with Star Wars).

Um....if you take into account the videogames and the entire novel run (all of which are Lucas authorized cannon), that's not quite true.

I know that's an OT response, but the comparisson is not true

[Kizyr]

Most of what you said is spot on, there are a few issues though.

3) In Damon's Spire one of the books mentions that it was (paraphrasing) "a huge fortress" that transported the people of the Blue Star to the Silver Star. Taken literally, this would imply a spaceship of somesort. Taken a little more liberally, it's safe to say this "huge fortress" is the Blue Spire.

The "Huge Fortress" is quite blatantly the ark / Goddess Tower bit you explore towards the end of SSS. I can't remember SSS's dialogue precisely, but the dialogue in Legend pointed out the purpose of the tower / fortress was to transport people to Lunar from the Blue Star. It's too much of a stretch to say it refers to both that fortress and the Blue Spire.

4) In Damon's Spire one of the books mentions something about evil creeping into the hearts of men on the Blue Star. Take a look at the EBC cutscene where people turn into Demons because they were filled with evil. (This one is going off more memory than the others, so it might not be entirely accurate).

That also gives a nice hint at how the Vile Tribe has both demonic and normal-looking people in it. And, to me, it indicates why Ghaleon turned into a demon by the end.

5) In Damon's Spire one of the books talks about a dragonmaster into the desert on the back of the white dragon. I can't remember, but I seem to remember the book saying it was the first dragonmaster. Does this mean that the book is talking about (DS Spoiler)

Like others pointed out, it definitely wouldn't refer to DS. DS was long after Lunar had already been settled, and there were plenty of dragonmasters prior to then. KF

[DaWrestla]

It doesn't fit in the sense that many of the books in Vane speak of a Magic Empire 1000 years prior to Lunar 1...It's issues like these that throw shadows on Lunar DS. I'm sure explinations can be made for it, but these issues should have been addressed.

Good point. I'm sure explanations could be made (like 1000 years is just a round-off), but good point nonetheless.

The "Huge Fortress" is quite blatantly the ark / Goddess Tower

Really? Then what's the whole point of the Blue Spire to begin with? Just a quick means for one person to travel between the Blue and Silver Stars? (genuine curiosity)

That also gives a nice hint at how the Vile Tribe has both demonic and normal-looking people in it. And, to me, it indicates why Ghaleon turned into a demon by the end

Ooooooo...that is a fascinating point, indeed. I was actually wondering that myself. Great explanation!

Like others pointed out, it definitely wouldn't refer to DS. DS was long after Lunar had already been settled, and there were plenty of dragonmasters prior to then.

Wait, but wasn't the whole point of DS to tell of the first major story in the history of Lunar (after the Blue Star peoples had settled it)?

[Angelalex242]

The first Dragonmaster is Louie. Most definitely not anyone from DS. Ignatius just isn't old enough to be Louie.

The Blue Spire is there for Lucia's benefit.
Star Dragon Tower is there for everyone else's benefit.

Althena evidently thought enough of Lucia to make a special tower just for her.

The Star Dragon Tower was plan B in case something happened to the Fortress of Althena (Like, oh, say, Zophar EATING it). Althena displays prophetic and precognitive powers, so she likely knew her fortress would be Zophar food someday, and prepared for it in advance.

[Kizyr]

Really? Then what's the whole point of the Blue Spire to begin with? Just a quick means for one person to travel between the Blue and Silver Stars? (genuine curiosity)

Could be. It's never fully explained, and left open to conjecture. But since the Blue Spire and Silver Spire transportation seems to be for individuals, it's unlikely they were ever used for relocating the entire population of the Blue Star at one time. Individual transport seems the most likely reason.

Angelalex's point is entirely conjecture on his part, like usual.

Wait, but wasn't the whole point of DS to tell of the first major story in the history of Lunar (after the Blue Star peoples had settled it)?

I don't know where you got that, but no, that was never the point of DS. It was just to tell another story of Lunar set long ago, before TSS. KF

[Angelalex242]

Yes, but saying, "It's impossible to know" doesn't really satisfy anyone.

Except people in Japan who LIKE it when it's impossible to know.

[Alunissage]

It is, however, the true, actual answer, unfettered by someone else's personal bias. There is no specific reason spelled out for the Blue Spire and the Star Dragon Tower, beyond the obvious function witnessed in the game. The end.

Even if you want to give what you consider a satisfying answer, you don't have the right to decide what he should think, which is why you need to clearly identify your speculation as such.

And nice generalization there. There are people outside of Japan who are okay with the unexplained also, or at least willing to recognize that the developers have the right to leave things open for their future installments.

[phyco126]

Bah, I still think the first Dragonmaster is Neil Armstrong.

[Alunissage]

Well, duh. But there was a change in translation, accidental or deliberate.

[DevNall]

I always got the impression, aside from the fact that Lucia could travel using it, that the Blue Spire was used to collect and send magic back to the Blue Star.

As for conjecture, it seems sort of an equivalent to Lucia's spire on the Blue Star. I wonder if maybe she (or Althena) could have gone there to sleep for some extended time, if they needed to.

[Werefrog]

I think the first Dragonmaster is the famous jazz musician Louis Armstrong.

[spoiler]Much like Jian, Dragonmaster Louis fought in a very unconventional way. He would defeat his enemies by playing really high notes on his trumpet. If that didn't work, he would hit them over the head with his trumpet until they passed out. [/spoiler]

I knew that Star Wars analogy would make somebody mad, but I stick by it.

[Roas Atrades]

I always got the impression, aside from the fact that Lucia could travel using it, that the Blue Spire was used to collect and send magic back to the Blue Star.

That makes a lot of sense. I would tend to support such a theory without obvious deterring information.

I knew that Star Wars analogy would make somebody mad, but I stick by it.

Well, I would not say mad, but I have been a SW fan since I was 2, so it is one of the closest things to my heart.

And if you stick by it, then please defend it, rather than blatent statement

[Kizyr]

I always got the impression, aside from the fact that Lucia could travel using it, that the Blue Spire was used to collect and send magic back to the Blue Star.

That makes a lot of sense. I would tend to support such a theory without obvious deterring information.

It is used also to collect magic for the restoration of the Blue Star. That was clarified in Eternal Blue. The same scene was axed from the remake, though. KF

[Roas Atrades]

It is used also to collect magic for the restoration of the Blue Star. That was clarified in Eternal Blue. The same scene was axed from the remake, though. KF

Yeah. I totally remember that scene where Lucia gets the stored magic.