Completed!

Post by **DragonmasterDan** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 5:42 am

I finished the game tonight. I'll post more elaborate opinions and such tommorow in all likelyhood.

Post by **DragonmasterDan** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 5:55 am

First off, here are my final thoughts on the game. It and fits in well in the Lunar universe, the look of the game and the music also gives it a very Lunar-ish feel.

The gameplay however is the first of Dragon Songs many downfalls. Here are a few of the negative gameplay elements, first off Battles take far too long especially when you don't have magic, even using R to speed battles up still takes too long to fight it out. Delivering packages for money is tedious and it takes far too long to save up for expensive items, acquiring hard to find items is a pain. The virtue and item mode set-up while an interesting idea makes the game tedious as you can't earn experience and try to acquire items to deliver as packages, this just slows the game down. Items can get stolen by enemies or break in battle, while this is somewhat realistic it's frutsturating when 32000 silver armor is damaged shortly after equipping it, especially when you earn 500-700 silver per delivery. The delivery system is too time consuming, it would be a nice way to earn extra silver but it's frusturating when its your primary source of income. Much has been made about running (as in through towns or dungeons not from battles) costing HP, once you get a ways into the game this doesn't become much of an issue as your HP gage rises, a plus is the fact that battles are generally pretty avoidable while running unlike the remakes of Lunar 1 and 2.

The story in the game is decent and fits into the Lunar universe, however the plot is rushed and the motivation for many characters isn't very well thought out.

The music seems heavily remixed from earlier Lunar games, TSS dungeon music, the opening theme in SSS, and some music from Eternal Blue are changed slightly in terms of melody and reused in the game. While this fits the setting it wreaks of cheapness.

Overall I can see why this game is getting such negative reviews, let's face it most game magazines and websites rate on a scale of 5-10 (since if a company complains they can go back and say, oh but 5 is average) and this game's drawbacks make it deserving of its low scores, while it has its positives I dread the thought of another Lunar done in this same fashion.

Post by **GhaleonOne** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 6:31 am

Just a note on the packages, after getting to Obleage (might have mispelt it), you can buy many sundries used in courier missions. Take a mission in the Gad's Express in Obleage once it opens up (I assume after going to Althena's Shrine), buy what you need, finish the mission. Quick money. Prior to the Althena's Shrine ordeal, you can go back and get your mission in Searis, buy what you need, and make some good money. It's a quick way to get the equipment. I may just spend a few hours doing this to gain a ton of silver so I don't have to worry about buying equipment for a while.

Post by **DragonmasterDan** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 6:53 am

GhaleonOne wrote:Just a note on the packages, after getting to Obleage (might have mispelt it), you can buy many sundries used in courier missions. Take a mission in the Gad's Express in Obleage once it opens up (I assume after going to Althena's Shrine), buy what you need, finish the mission. Quick money. Prior to the Althena's Shrine ordeal, you can go back and get your mission in Searis, buy what you need, and make some good money. It's a quick way to get the equipment. I may just spend a few hours doing this to gain a ton of silver so I don't have to worry about buying equipment for a while.

It's mostly common stuff, the better paying jobs need more than what's there.

Post by **Alunissage** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 6:56 am

Not so sure about the music; I heard pieces from SSS and EB, but not TSS and certainly not the opening of SSS. But I did play most of the game with the sound off and only listened to the sound gallery after I finished. Could you tell me which soundroom pieces you're talking about? By number, please, not name; I don't have the domestic version yet.

Post by **DragonmasterDan** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 7:17 am

Alunissage wrote:Not so sure about the music; I heard pieces from SSS and EB, but not TSS and certainly not the opening of SSS. But I did play most of the game with the sound off and only listened to the sound gallery after I finished. Could you tell me which soundroom pieces you're talking about? By number, please, not name; I don't have the domestic version yet.

I'd have to go through and listen to them, if you don;t mind spoilers I can PM you where I heard various remixes.

Added in edit: Themes 12 and 30 are TSS remixes (VERY similar sounding).

Post by **Alunissage** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 7:59 am

They're not spoilers; I finished the import and already knew the story anyway. Go ahead. But you're mistaken on those two:

12 is based on SSS's dragon theme, not TSS's. The second chord is different in the two; it's just a dominant chord in TSS and it's a borrowed chord (flat VI) in SSS. Listen to both TSS's and SSS's themes and then #12 in DS and you'll hear that the first two chords are identical in SSS and DS; the orchestration is also much closer to SSS's piece.

30 isn't in TSS either. It makes its debut in EB. Why that particular piece was also used in SSS and now propagated here, I have no idea, since it's by far the least attractive Lunar theme. It's a little better in DS than previously, but that's not saying much.

Others that are based on SSS are 13, 14, 15 maybe, 32, 34 (is this what you meant by being like the title?), 35, 36. 21 doesn't directly quote things, but reminds me of two or more SSS themes pretty strongly. 9 reminded me of a MS track a little bit.

Post by **DragonmasterDan** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 8:29 am

Alunissage wrote:They're not spoilers; I finished the import and already knew the story anyway. Go ahead. But you're mistaken on those two:

12 is based on SSS's dragon theme, not TSS's. The second chord is different in the two; it's just a dominant chord in TSS and it's a borrowed chord (flat VI) in SSS. Listen to both TSS's and SSS's themes and then #12 in DS and you'll hear that the first two chords are identical in SSS and DS; the orchestration is also much closer to SSS's piece.

30 isn't in TSS either. It makes its debut in EB. Why that particular piece was also used in SSS and now propagated here, I have no idea, since it's by far the least attractive Lunar theme. It's a little better in DS than previously, but that's not saying much.

Others that are based on SSS are 13, 14, 15 maybe, 32, 34 (is this what you meant by being like the title?), 35, 36. 21 doesn't directly quote things, but reminds me of two or more SSS themes pretty strongly. 9 reminded me of a MS track a little bit.

12 still sounds eerily similar to the Dragon theme (after passing a trial or visiting quark) from TSS) that's where I recognized it. The otherone sounds like dungeon music from TSS (I think immediately of the Merbian Sewers when I haer it.

Post by **Alunissage** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 8:40 am

Put the TSS game disc into your CD player and listen to Quark's introduction -- heck, listen to the whole thing and try to find anything that sounds like #30. Then put SSSC into your PSX and use Alex's ocarina to listen to the dragon theme and the dragon cave theme. They may remind you of TSS, but they're not from TSS. The Meribian sewers music in TSS is the same as the Weird Woods and Meribia after Mel's turned to stone and a few other places -- it bears no resemblance to the dragon cave music. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but you really are mistaken here. #12 reminds you of TSS's dragon theme because SSS's dragon theme was based on TSS's -- but the harmony is pretty different. Make sure you listen to SSSC's music before arguing the point further.

Angelalex242 · Post by **Angelalex242** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 9:33 am

Well...you completed type people.

Bromides. Are there any?

Warn me now. Cause, if this is like other Lunars, you've got like...a 5 second window of opportunity to get 'em, then they're missed forever.

Post by **DragonmasterDan** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 1:10 pm

Angelalex242 wrote:Well...you completed type people.

Bromides. Are there any?

Warn me now. Cause, if this is like other Lunars, you've got like...a 5 second window of opportunity to get 'em, then they're missed forever.

No bromides

On a side note and a reply to Alunnisage, I'll listen through music again later.

Spirit Icana · Post by **Spirit Icana** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 5:09 pm

After a little over 18hrs of play time, I've completed the game as well.

I must say that the game REALLY picked up, gameplay and storywise, once the Four Dragons plot began to set in motion, and it carried through strong until the very end where it slaps the fact that this is merely a side-story hard across your face.

My eyes watered a little at the end because everything was finally starting to run well and then:

~Spoilers~

Althena dies and is then reborn as Lucia again, bla, bla, all told by two barely important characters in the game, right after the event where the game felt full of heart when Althena died and Jian was full of angst and almost completely broken. No strong production values accompanied Jian and Lucia's reunion at the end, and the story just ended with a clear word signaling that this was just a little side story beginning to the real event that is the Silver Star Story. Now that breaks me up a bit.

~End Spoilers~

This game was brimming with potential and it began to show during the latter half of the gameplay and story. In the end, I felt the developers didn't put the care I was hoping for into this game, but I enjoyed it while it lasted and I'm considering running through the game again to see how I will look at things the second time around.

Overall, I liked Lunar Dragon Song and would recommend it to some gamers looking for a little change in pace.

Post by **Shiva Indis** » Sat Oct 01, 2005 7:26 pm

Spirit Icana, it sounds like we have pretty similar persepectives on the game. I wonder if the staff didn't have more planned for Lunar DS that they didn't have time to execute, because there are a lot of loose ends, and the ending seemed very abrupt.

Bigtime Spoilers:
The biggest loose ends in my opinion are Rufus and Ignatius - neither of their ends seemed definitive enough that I believed that the characters were actually dead. Rufus cracks dry jokes about how he can't die, and we're supposed to believe Gideon killed him based just on that sword? And as for Ignatius, I have commented to Kizyr that when someone falls to their 'death' in a video game, don't believe it until you see the body. Imagining a remake of this game where this ending is a mere springboard to the REAL ending is very easy indeed.

Post by **Kizyr** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 1:35 am

Little aside about Rufus, responding to SI's comment...

Bigtime spoilers:
If you're curious, the original script called for Gideon to be carrying in Rufus' severed arm holding the sword, instead of just the sword.. KF

Post by **Shiva Indis** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 5:54 am

Well, that would've had a LOT more finality about it.

It might have single-handedly gotten the game a higher rating too...

That's really cool. It's the kind of information I love to hear about.

DevNall · Post by **DevNall** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:04 am

That's awesome, Kiz -- where'd you hear that? Why was it changed? Any other fun things that were cut?

So some other points I thought were interesting... If you haven't gotten to the dragons yet, beware of the questions in the below boxes.

Enos said Delrich temple was "once a place of worship of the Four Dragons." This seems new... did anything like this ever come up in previous games? Delrich seemed awfully prisonish for a place of worship.
Titus: "That is correct. Originally the Frontier existed to confine those evildoers for whom there was no other hope... Until, that is, Ignatius turned his attention to it. Through a terrible abuse of Black Magic, he took the fiends of the Frontier and molded them into a Vile Tribe. Now, he stands at their head, a terrible and mighty army of evil." Does this match with previous story about the Vile Tribe?
The beastpeople seem rather populous in this game... wonder what happened to their big cities...
Red Dragon: "We dragons, as servants of the Dragonmaster, cannot turn against Ignatius. Furthermore, we cannot allow the existance of anyone who threatens our master. It follows that we cannot aid anyone who wishes to become such a threat. Even if he is the leader of a rebellion against the Goddess, the Dragonmaster means everything to us dragons." You can't take the trials, but when you beat the dragons, you've passed? Doesn't seem very dedicated.
Red Dragon: "You have won, and thus I have lost.
And, just as I am on the verge of doing now, the loser shall vanish forever from this world." Are they actually dying, which might make sense given they appear to be different from the dragons in SSS? Though if they all die, won't "the world darken"?
Out of curiosity, were the Dragons given names in the Japanese version? I didn't see any here...
Titus... fairy? huh? what?
Is it just me or does the Frontier seem a lot smaller in this game?

Overall...
I guess the real reason this was called Genesis was because it was the setup for the events of SSS and EB; but I don't understand, if Althena had been reborn in human form before, why was Ghaleon so upset when it happened? The fact that it was her final rebirth wasn't decided until later on, right?

Does anyone else feel like this makes Ghaleon sort of... unoriginal?

Post by **Alunissage** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:26 am

Yes, the storyline does rather cheapen Lunar 1's, or the other way around.

No, the dragons didn't have names in Japanese as far as I could tell (and I was looking).

The Frontier is pretty small compared to TSS's, but SSSC's was only about two locations, so it kind of fits there. Except for the whole crater thing in SSSC.

Post by **GhaleonOne** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:29 am

Kiz got that from the same place I did. Same thing with Vane and it's removal.

DevNall · Post by **DevNall** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:15 am

Oh, regarding the music, track 27 sounds very similiar to SSSC/EB, too.

Post by **Shiva Indis** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 4:59 pm

In response to DevNall:

In regards to Althena's rebirths, I don't think we can call DS Lucia a rebirth in the same sense as Luna (in the remake at least... in the original it's hard to say). Lucia's more like Althena in disguise. I remember someone (Titus?) saying that Althena sealed her memory and power and went among humans to hide from Ignatius.

What makes Ignatius different from Ghaleon is that Ignatius obviously has contempt for Althena, while with Ghaleon, we don't really know what he thinks of the Goddess. (It seems like there's some lingering affection there, but that's my interpretation.)

About music... song 30 (Requiem). I would've called this one 'EB Dragon Cave Theme Deconstructed Mix'.

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