*adjusted*

[Nobiyuki77]

*adjusted below*

[Benevolent_Ghaleon]

Sonic sez: "Giga illo has a nice ass!"

[zqfmbg]

Wow. Uhm. How do you play Wii games like that?

[Alunissage]

Nobi, remind me why you created this character? My recollection is that she is intended as a mascot for a girls' gaming site, to encourage girls to play games more. So naturally you have depicted her in a pose designed to draw attention to her sexual characteristics and leaning on her elbows in such a way, as my husband noted, as to make using the controller nearly impossible. Nice job drawing yet another token girl pretending to play while serving as eye candy for the all-important male eye, that REALLY makes you stand out from the crowd as a fanartist.

[ilovemyguitar]

Alun, I think I sorta love you right now.

[Nobiyuki77]

Nobi, remind me why you created this character? My recollection is that she is intended as a mascot for a girls' gaming site, to encourage girls to play games more. So naturally you have depicted her in a pose designed to draw attention to her sexual characteristics and leaning on her elbows in such a way, as my husband noted, as to make using the controller nearly impossible. Nice job drawing yet another token girl pretending to play while serving as eye candy for the all-important male eye, that REALLY makes you stand out from the crowd as a fanartist.

... sorry.

[Hirox]

If it makes a differnece I thought it was a good drawing Nobi! I dont even like anime stuff. Do you have any lunar fanart...I thought I saw a thread that you did a human form of ruby...or am I wrong?

[Nobiyuki77]

If it makes a difference I thought it was a good drawing Nobi! I dont even like anime stuff. Do you have any lunar fanart...I thought I saw a thread that you did a human form of ruby...or am I wrong?

You know, I sorta remember thinking about something like that, but I don't remember if I actually drew it. Might have been someone else, I'll have to look that up.

I guess 26 years old + loneliness + free weekend = desire to draw sexy fanart. Actually, I was really worried about it at first but a couple of my female friends who I was IMing said it was cute, so I thought "What the heck, I'll post it".

Impulse = mistake I suppose. >> I didn't think it was *that* bad.

[Nobiyuki77]

Wow. Uhm. How do you play Wii games like that?

Brawl doesn't use pointer. I've seen my sister and her roomie play that way. >>;

[Benevolent_Ghaleon]

Nobi, remind me why you created this character? My recollection is that she is intended as a mascot for a girls' gaming site, to encourage girls to play games more. So naturally you have depicted her in a pose designed to draw attention to her sexual characteristics and leaning on her elbows in such a way, as my husband noted, as to make using the controller nearly impossible. Nice job drawing yet another token girl pretending to play while serving as eye candy for the all-important male eye, that REALLY makes you stand out from the crowd as a fanartist.

... sorry.

lol guilt trip successful. i knew i should've right clicked.

Women could just realize that they have the other end of the spectrum in the form of day time television. Look at the "men" on them and the tight nut-grip their women have on them.

[Sonic#]

Oh my, daytime television? I've seen some, enough to confirm what my professor said about an aspect of it. Look for assertive women on those shows. They either "get what's coming to them" or calm down.

Though your point is also well-taken. Man-objects are out there.

[Nobiyuki77]

Adjusted somewhat.



To address Alun's point about Giga's purpose, yes she's supposed to be a girl gamer. But her original point was to be a girl gamer who didn't fit the major stereotypes of girl gamers which were either

1) fat ugly slob
2) macho man-woman

The idea was to depict a character who was both a hardcore gamer and a normal girl. She's attractive, and wears attractive outfits that compliment her figure. I was worried at first about this pic as well, but speaking with my sister about she saw nothing wrong with it, and also encouraged me to draw more of what I like rather than what I think everyone wants. She also made a good point to me that when drawing women, 99% it falls into one of two categories

1) plain and boring
2) sexy and interesting

She said "Yes, you could have drawn her sitting up, indian style and playing that way, but it'd be a really boring picture. This is ecchi, but interesting to look at." However, I also took it upon myself to fix the two major issues this pic had.

1) the cleavage was a bit much. Removed.
2) Using the Classic Controller for better realism with the pose.

Lastly, she told me that I'm a straight guy and I should stop being embarassed about wanting to draw one of my characters in a somewhat sexy manner. Girls can be sexy and not be tasteless, and she felt this picture hit that balance very well. Thus I worked with it and will continue to work with it. Sorry if it offends.

[Kizyr]

It's more important to have a good justification for what you say, than to please everyone. And this way, you have a reason and basis for evaluating and incorporating others' criticism.

I actually like the image, at least how it is now. I think you made some good changes.

Although, maybe her skirt could be a bit longer? Wearing clothing that short isn't very comfortable--at least, that's what I've found. KF

[Benevolent_Ghaleon]

Your sister sounds awesome.

[Alunissage]

Actually, it's the short-shorts part of her pose that really suggested she was being drawn to indicate sexual receptivity, and I see you did nothing to address that. Cleavage is kind of inevitable in anyone over a C cup in the pose you drew, and for some reason every girl ever drawn falls into that category.

I don't watch daytime TV (or nighttime TV, for that matter), so I have no knowledge of the specific stereotypes to which B_G refers. But it's very obvious that B_G equates "assertive" with "rude and loudmouthed" in his comments about Jessica and thinks such females deserve to "get what's coming to them" for daring to speak their mind. Naturally, he also thinks girls who say things validating his own viewpoints are awesome.

It won't be surprising that I find Nobi's sister's sex to be insufficient reason to agree with her.

To address Alun's point about Giga's purpose, yes she's supposed to be a girl gamer. But her original point was to be a girl gamer who didn't fit the major stereotypes of girl gamers which were either

1) fat ugly slob
2) macho man-woman

The idea was to depict a character who was both a hardcore gamer and a normal girl. She's attractive, and wears attractive outfits that compliment her figure. I was worried at first about this pic as well, but speaking with my sister about she saw nothing wrong with it, and also encouraged me to draw more of what I like rather than what I think everyone wants.

Again, I'm not excessively familiar with stereotypes 1 and 2. I am familiar unto nausea with stereotype 3, "a normal girl who's attractive and wears attractive outfits". Do you really think that all "normal" girls look like that? Funny how only the attractive ones in attractive -- that is, arousal-inducing -- clothing are depicted. A normal girl might be an A-cup. A normal girl might not be slender just like the anime girls. A normal girl might freaking object to existing only to have parts of her stared at, not wearing a happy grin at the prospect. Again, you are NOT breaking any ground here. You are, in fact, blending right in with the foreground of every female not in types 1 and 2. And if acceptance of type 3 is what the site you work(ed?) with wants, then it sounds like what they really want is validation that they too can be sex objects... pretty girls wanting reassurance that they're still pretty. Wake up. There's more of a spectrum than the set you describe, and "normality" falls somewhere in the middle. Or, more accurately, covers a large range, not just the corner of it that anime depicts.

She also made a good point to me that when drawing women, 99% it falls into one of two categories

1) plain and boring
2) sexy and interesting

She said "Yes, you could have drawn her sitting up, indian style and playing that way, but it'd be a really boring picture. This is ecchi, but interesting to look at."

So rather than develop a category 3, you plunked yourself squarely into category 2, by far the largest category. Way to grow as an artist. You really can't think of ANY way to be interesting that doesn't equate that with sexy? Because this is a cop-out of the same type as advertising that uses the "sex sells" formula.

However, I also took it upon myself to fix the two major issues this pic had.

1) the cleavage was a bit much. Removed.
2) Using the Classic Controller for better realism with the pose.

This also improved the left hand, which was a bit misshapen. I still think that 3) the barely-there shorts was the biggest issue. Does no one in the Gigaverse own a pair of pants? While I've enjoyed seeing your developing drawing skills over the years, I really think it's time that you worked on the draping of clothing...

Lastly, she told me that I'm a straight guy and I should stop being embarassed about wanting to draw one of my characters in a somewhat sexy manner. Girls can be sexy and not be tasteless, and she felt this picture hit that balance very well. Thus I worked with it and will continue to work with it. Sorry if it offends.

This is certainly your choice. After all, if you don't draw your own sexy material, you'll never find anything in the rest of the world to give you nosebleeds whenever you wish, as is the right of any hetero male. If you felt embarrassed about seeing girls as fodder for sexual fantasy, you might start thinking of them as humans with actual status equal to your own, and we can't have that.

[Nobiyuki77]

Again, I'm not excessively familiar with stereotypes 1 and 2. I am familiar unto nausea with stereotype 3, "a normal girl who's attractive and wears attractive outfits". Do you really think that all "normal" girls look like that? Funny how only the attractive ones in attractive -- that is, arousal-inducing -- clothing are depicted. A normal girl might be an A-cup. A normal girl might not be slender just like the anime girls. A normal girl might freaking object to existing only to have parts of her stared at, not wearing a happy grin at the prospect. Again, you are NOT breaking any ground here. You are, in fact, blending right in with the foreground of every female not in types 1 and 2. And if acceptance of type 3 is what the site you work(ed?) with wants, then it sounds like what they really want is validation that they too can be sex objects... pretty girls wanting reassurance that they're still pretty. Wake up. There's more of a spectrum than the set you describe, and "normality" falls somewhere in the middle. Or, more accurately, covers a large range, not just the corner of it that anime depicts.

So rather than develop a category 3, you plunked yourself squarely into category 2, by far the largest category. Way to grow as an artist. You really can't think of ANY way to be interesting that doesn't equate that with sexy? Because this is a cop-out of the same type as advertising that uses the "sex sells" formula.

This is certainly your choice. After all, if you don't draw your own sexy material, you'll never find anything in the rest of the world to give you nosebleeds whenever you wish, as is the right of any hetero male. If you felt embarrassed about seeing girls as fodder for sexual fantasy, you might start thinking of them as humans with actual status equal to your own, and we can't have that.

Again, I'm not trying to depict her as an object, I'm depicting her as being attractive. If I wanted to depict her as an object, I'd have drawn her on all fours sticking her bum in the air for no good reason (something lame like "looking for my contacts" or some other BS), or just in her unmentionables, or something to that effect.

It's funny you mention the bit about seeing women as humans with equal status, because anyone who knows me will tell you that I do more than most men do. And strangely enough, it's also one of the reasons I just can't ever seem to get a girlfriend. I'm too nice to them, and all the treatment I ever get in return is a quick pat on the back while they go give themselves to some bastard who hits them twice a week and treats them like -Dragon Diamond-. As nice and respectful as I am to them, they tend to act like they don't want it.

Other men have called me a "-Plantella-" on several occasions. They tell me to just go over there and take them. That's what they want, they tell me. I wouldn't believe them and would try to earn respect and love by giving them respect and love. It has never worked once in my entire life. Not once. And I'm not some ugly bastard or anything. So then, the friends I don't believe go over there and just "take them" and voalla, they're completely taken. It's baffled me to no end on several occasions. Sometimes I wonder why I even bother...

... and I'll stop there, because I'm getting seriously off topic.

[Benevolent_Ghaleon]

Again, I'm not excessively familiar with stereotypes 1 and 2. I am familiar unto nausea with stereotype 3, "a normal girl who's attractive and wears attractive outfits". Do you really think that all "normal" girls look like that? Funny how only the attractive ones in attractive -- that is, arousal-inducing -- clothing are depicted. A normal girl might be an A-cup. A normal girl might not be slender just like the anime girls. A normal girl might freaking object to existing only to have parts of her stared at, not wearing a happy grin at the prospect. Again, you are NOT breaking any ground here. You are, in fact, blending right in with the foreground of every female not in types 1 and 2. And if acceptance of type 3 is what the site you work(ed?) with wants, then it sounds like what they really want is validation that they too can be sex objects... pretty girls wanting reassurance that they're still pretty. Wake up. There's more of a spectrum than the set you describe, and "normality" falls somewhere in the middle. Or, more accurately, covers a large range, not just the corner of it that anime depicts.

So rather than develop a category 3, you plunked yourself squarely into category 2, by far the largest category. Way to grow as an artist. You really can't think of ANY way to be interesting that doesn't equate that with sexy? Because this is a cop-out of the same type as advertising that uses the "sex sells" formula.

This is certainly your choice. After all, if you don't draw your own sexy material, you'll never find anything in the rest of the world to give you nosebleeds whenever you wish, as is the right of any hetero male. If you felt embarrassed about seeing girls as fodder for sexual fantasy, you might start thinking of them as humans with actual status equal to your own, and we can't have that.

Again, I'm not trying to depict her as an object, I'm depicting her as being attractive. If I wanted to depict her as an object, I'd have drawn her on all fours sticking her bum in the air for no good reason (something lame like "looking for my contacts" or some other BS), or just in her unmentionables, or something to that effect.

It's funny you mention the bit about seeing women as humans with equal status, because anyone who knows me will tell you that I do more than most men do. And strangely enough, it's also one of the reasons I just can't ever seem to get a girlfriend. I'm too nice to them, and all the treatment I ever get in return is a quick pat on the back while they go give themselves to some bastard who hits them twice a week and treats them like -Dragon Diamond-. As nice and respectful as I am to them, they tend to act like they don't want it.

Other men have called me a "-Plantella-" on several occasions. They tell me to just go over there and take them. That's what they want, they tell me. I wouldn't believe them and would try to earn respect and love by giving them respect and love. It has never worked once in my entire life. Not once. And I'm not some ugly bastard or anything. So then, the friends I don't believe go over there and just "take them" and voalla, they're completely taken. It's baffled me to no end on several occasions. Sometimes I wonder why I even bother...

... and I'll stop there, because I'm getting seriously off topic.

As far as being a "-Plantella-" (isn't that a sexist term?) goes. You could start remedying that by being more assertive. Mrs. Sandy here needs to lighten up.

Hey, Alun! People can look at a woman as sexually attractive..hell they can even go so far as to have sex with her and then STILL respect her as a person. Or did you think only women were deep enough for that?

Nobiyuki, you're doing nothing wrong. You know that you're a good person. Don't let yourself be a victim of her insecurities. Perhaps she came from a family that threw a lot of sexism her way, perhaps she just feels ugly. who knows? Not really your problem, though. Don't be ashamed of being attracted to women. or ecchi drawings. Also don't think you're lecherous for drawing a womans chest any larger than Lina Inverse's.

Also, there were times that Jessica was unnecessarily rude and mouthy. It wasn't always called for. You're welcome to make assumptions about my opinions to further perpetuate the view you've already formed of me, though.

[Werefrog]

Also, there were times that Jessica was unnecessarily rude and mouthy. It wasn't always called for. You're welcome to make assumptions about my opinions to further perpetuate the view you've already formed of me, though.

I'm not going to argue with the whole sexual representation of women in the media because I need to finish up my short story for creative writing, and I can't get this involved in another digital discourse.

I'll just say that I never really thought that Jessica was rude. She was just spunky, and anyone would have to be put up with a man with such an overbearing personality like Ronfar's.

[GhaleonOne]

I'll just say that I never really thought that Jessica was rude. She was just spunky, and anyone would have to be put up with a man with such an overbearing personality like Ronfar's.

Did you mean Kyle's? I don't think Ronfar was anywhere near Kyle's overbearing level of personality.

[Nobiyuki77]

Also, there were times that Jessica was unnecessarily rude and mouthy. It wasn't always called for. You're welcome to make assumptions about my opinions to further perpetuate the view you've already formed of me, though.

I'm not going to argue with the whole sexual representation of women in the media because I need to finish up my short story for creative writing, and I can't get this involved in another digital discourse.

I'll just say that I never really thought that Jessica was rude. She was just spunky, and anyone would have to be put up with a man with such an overbearing personality like Kyle's.

stealth edit